AMC and Mopar

[blk68jave]

Someone was mentioning that a lot of parts from Mopar will bolt right up to AMC. Is this correct?

[Big Bad AMX]

Ford, AMC and Mopar used the same bolt pattern on their wheels (in the 60s-70s era). And starting in 72 AMC used the Chrysler 727 and 904 trannys, but the bellhousings and tailshafts are different so you can't pull a 727 out of a Challenger and bolt it up to a Javelin. Other than that I can't think of any.


.

[blk68jave]

What about disc brakes from mopar? I've seen a couple of ebay items listed for an AMC and they were from a Mopar.

[304_dude]

Yes there are things that bolt right in... a late 60's Mopar B body rear end will just fine. Any late 60's through 70's Ford electric wiper motor will work as a replacement. Mopar lifters will work fine unless your going for the newer type and will need shorter push rods. Early Fords and Mopars use the same Kesley Hays single piston caliper as the 71-73 AMCs. There are many other things that AMC swaped with the big three... Ford pullys, GM smog devices, Ford starting systems, GM starting switch, Ford and Chevy aftermarket rockers, AMC used MOPAR 440 valves as a racing option... there is a booklet on ebay and a nice website that gives some options for crossover parts. Remember AMC used a lot of extras from the big three, but bodies, lenses, interior parts are not enterchangable.

I did make one thing work that is not interchangable... I liked the late 70's MOPAR Magnum side mirors, they are like AMC's but more aerodynamic and mount from inside the door... so that the mounting screws are hidden. But this is my prefrence, for my custom car.

I heard of an AMCer using a MOPAR rod rocker assembly for racing since AMC and MOPAR share the same cylinder spacing. I think there may be a little machining of the head to allow placment and mounting of the bar.

[blk68jave]

Thanks for the information. Could you tell me what's the name of the site that gives a nice list of interchangable parts? Or if the ebay item is still for sale?

Thanks Again.

[304_dude]

The booklet name I do not have but you can alway find it on ebay. Just look for AMC parts book or booklet in the search... I aways find it when looking around... you may have to look once a week.

http://www.american-powersports.com/...ech/amc_pi.htm

[blk68jave]

Will do. Thanks Again!

[Big Bad AMX]

With a creative mind, a cutting torch and a welder just about anything can be made to fit. A Ford 9" rear-end will work fine too. But why swap the rear-end? The American Motors Model 20 rear-end is a Dana 20. AMC used Dana extensively for three decades across their entire model line including Jeep. Their toughness, reliability and durability have been proven over the years in street use, Road Racing, NASCAR, Drag Racing and Off-Road racing. Parts for them are easily attainable. Want to upgrade your Javelin's Open rear-end to a Posi or Locker unit? Or Air Locker? Want to change the ratio? Need seals, gaskets, and/or bearings? It's all available. Pushing 500+hp and want to upgrade the axles? One-piece forged steel axles are available too. Just pick up the phone and order them. Swap to a Ford, Mopar or Chevy rear-end and you'll be modifying your brake lines, emergency brake cables, shock mounts, drive shaft, U-Joints, speedometer gear and brakes. Not to mention the confusion for future owners if (or when) the paper work stating what was changed gets lost. It's a change that is not necessary.

Yes, there are a few parts AMC got from outside suppliers (they all did) but AMC did not use Chrysler lifters and Ford rocker arms in their engines. Similarities are just that. Similarities. AMC did not cobble their engines together with a bunch of pieces and parts made elsewhere. Their engineering and manufacturing departments were there for more than just show. And for the items that will swap many of them aren't a simple worry-free drop-in. And really, what's the benefit? Why put SB Ford rocker arms, valve springs, or Mopar lifters and pushrods in an AMC V-8 because the fit is "close" when you can easily buy the AMC parts that are made and designed specifically for the AMC engine? Look at the swap list and see how many items are listed with a question mark or are stated as being close. As an example there is listed "318 Mopar oil pump gears(are lil longer, make cover that's recessed)" - DON'T DO THIS! Brand new AMC oil pump gears and timing chain covers can be bought from many different sources - why jeopardize the life of your AMC engine by doing something like this? What's the advantage? And buying Ford, GM and Chrysler parts to replace readily obtainable AMC parts will only reduce the sales of the correct parts we need and thereby result in fewer manufacturers supplying the parts for us. If the parts have the same part number okay, but unless you have a lot of experience building engines, machining parts and are willing to risk your engine to experiments only use the correct, and proven, AMC parts. And to clarify your question about AMC parts in Mopar packages - since the Chrysler takeover in '87 they continued to produce the AMC 360 to 1990 and the 258 to 2004 for the Jeep line. So you will see some parts packaged and sold under the Mopar label for AMC - BUT these parts are/were designed, engineered and manufactured specifically for AMC applications.

I have talked to many people over the years who have had local professional engine builders who, though they have a good reputation building engines, rebuild the few AMC engines they see like a small-block Chevy because they have a preconceived notion that they're "just like a Chevy 350" (they don't know, and they really don't care - the SB Chevy is 99% of their business, not AMC). The AMC engine owner complains that the engine is down on power, leaks oil and/or anti-freeze and is unreliable or 'it just doesn't run right'. Of course it's going to run poorly and leak - it's not a small-block Chevy and it shouldn't be rebuilt, setup like, or use Chevy parts. The engine builder can't figure it out and writes it off as 'just the way that AMC junk runs'. The owner is stuck with an engine that doesn't run right - and the bill.

Build AMCs to AMC specifications using AMC parts or parts made specifically for AMCs and you'll be fine; otherwise you're taking unnecessary risks for no benefit whatsoever.



.

[blk68jave]

Thanks for the in-depth explanation. My question was more out of curiosity rather then I wanted to use Mopar, Ford, or Chevy parts. However if I’m having difficulty located certain items such as lets say a front spindle, it would be nice to know if I could take on from Car Make “X”.

[donsjave]

With a creative mind, a cutting torch and a welder just about anything can be made to fit. A Ford 9" rear-end will work fine too. But why swap the rear-end? The American Motors Model 20 rear-end is a Dana 20. AMC used Dana extensively for three decades across their entire model line including Jeep. Their toughness, reliability and durability have been proven over the years in street use, Road Racing, NASCAR, Drag Racing and Off-Road racing. Parts for them are easily attainable. Want to upgrade your Javelin's Open rear-end to a Posi or Locker unit? Or Air Locker? Want to change the ratio? Need seals, gaskets, and/or bearings? It's all available. Pushing 500+hp and want to upgrade the axles? One-piece forged steel axles are available too. Just pick up the phone and order them. Swap to a Ford, Mopar or Chevy rear-end and you'll be modifying your brake lines, emergency brake cables, shock mounts, drive shaft, U-Joints, speedometer gear and brakes. Not to mention the confusion for future owners if (or when) the paper work stating what was changed gets lost. It's a change that is not necessary.

Yes, there are a few parts AMC got from outside suppliers (they all did) but AMC did not use Chrysler lifters and Ford rocker arms in their engines. Similarities are just that. Similarities. AMC did not cobble their engines together with a bunch of pieces and parts made elsewhere. Their engineering and manufacturing departments were there for more than just show. And for the items that will swap many of them aren't a simple worry-free drop-in. And really, what's the benefit? Why put SB Ford rocker arms, valve springs, or Mopar lifters and pushrods in an AMC V-8 because the fit is "close" when you can easily buy the AMC parts that are made and designed specifically for the AMC engine? Look at the swap list and see how many items are listed with a question mark or are stated as being close. As an example there is listed "318 Mopar oil pump gears(are lil longer, make cover that's recessed)" - DON'T DO THIS! Brand new AMC oil pump gears and timing chain covers can be bought from many different sources - why jeopardize the life of your AMC engine by doing something like this? What's the advantage? And buying Ford, GM and Chrysler parts to replace readily obtainable AMC parts will only reduce the sales of the correct parts we need and thereby result in fewer manufacturers supplying the parts for us. If the parts have the same part number okay, but unless you have a lot of experience building engines, machining parts and are willing to risk your engine to experiments only use the correct, and proven, AMC parts. And to clarify your question about AMC parts in Mopar packages - since the Chrysler takeover in '87 they continued to produce the AMC 360 to 1990 and the 258 to 2004 for the Jeep line. So you will see some parts packaged and sold under the Mopar label for AMC - BUT these parts are/were designed, engineered and manufactured specifically for AMC applications.

I have talked to many people over the years who have had local professional engine builders who, though they have a good reputation building engines, rebuild the few AMC engines they see like a small-block Chevy because they have a preconceived notion that they're "just like a Chevy 350" (they don't know, and they really don't care - the SB Chevy is 99% of their business, not AMC). The AMC engine owner complains that the engine is down on power, leaks oil and/or anti-freeze and is unreliable or 'it just doesn't run right'. Of course it's going to run poorly and leak - it's not a small-block Chevy and it shouldn't be rebuilt, setup like, or use Chevy parts. The engine builder can't figure it out and writes it off as 'just the way that AMC junk runs'. The owner is stuck with an engine that doesn't run right - and the bill.

Build AMCs to AMC specifications using AMC parts or parts made specifically for AMCs and you'll be fine; otherwise you're taking unnecessary risks for no benefit whatsoever.



.

I have to agree with BigBad on this issue. I have always used AMC or parts made for AMC engines for along time. The benefits are immeasurable and you get the right part in the right place.